web browsing with java support

[Chuck Hallenbeck]

Hi people,

Kenny's comments a couple of days ago about supporting existing web
browsers which in turn support existing javascript libraries are
important observations. There are at least two such products for the
text console, elinks and edbrowse. Both projects could use a little
help, and the time spent doing that would be time well spent.

The Mozilla javascript libraries are now packaged for all major Linux
distros, and can be compiled from sources made available by Mozilla if
you would rather. Fedora just calls them "js", but Debian calls them
either "smjs" (Sarge) or "mozjs" (Sid), not sure where Etch comes down
on this. Both elinks and edbrowse rely on these libraries and offer a
range of features using them.

The difference between elinks and edbrowse is a fundamental
philosophical one, as it is the difference between a two dimensional
view of the screen and a one dimensional view of it. Let me explain a
little.

Two dimensional means rows and columns. The screen has a fixed size,
usually 25 by 80 but possibly different, and it matters a lot where
things are in that space. Thus screen readers are position-sensitive.
This is an incredibly natural way to think of the screen, and unless
you try another approach, it is not easy to see any merit in any other
view. A natural consequence of this view is the use of a "point and
click" approach, and (fanfare here) enter the mouse! Okay, the mouse
leaves blind folks in the dust, but now enter key strokes that emulate
the mouse. But try to persuade a sighted power user that keystrokes are
as good as a mouse. It will not work.

One dimensional means "before and after", or "above and below", and
thinks of the screen as a substitute for an infinitely long roll of
paper on which output can be printed, a line at a time. Am I the only
one here who remembers teletype machines with rolls of paper? You type,
it makes a line of print. The computer responds, another line or maybe
several. You want to review what just happened, just glance back up the
page to review what's there. It won't change while you're doing
something else, it just gets farther back. 

The classic application using a one dimensional approach is the line
editor, which comes in many forms, "ed" being the most popular. But on
mainframes there was "qed", and "fred", and others, all very powerful,
and all one dimensional. CP/M had one called "ed", but the Redmond
folks called it "edlin" in DOS. Then at one point it went two
dimensional and was called "edit", and soon thereafter DOS went not
only two dimensional but graphical as well, and Redmond called it
Windows. 

The one dimensional approach is alive and well, it remains powerful and
flexible, is keeping abreast of the best two dimensional text mode
browsers, and is worthy of support. Granted, the bandwagon is going in
the other direction, but not everyone is jumping aboard.

I'm not convinced we need brand new tools, especially if they only try
to do the same old thing that other tools do. We need to sharpen the
tools we already have, which are not half bad already.

Chuck

-- 
The Moon is Waning Gibbous (83% of Full)
 But you can get a few downloads from http://www.mhcable.com/~chuckh