interesting experiment.

[Toby Fisher]

On Thu, 23 May 2002, Janina Sajka wrote:

> Toby:
>
> I was never able to make hide nor hair of exactly that file. My
> last heavy use of Win was exactly Win 98, though it was certainly
> before JFW 3.5.
>
> I don't know that we're exactly OK in saying "it's accessible" if
> it's dependent on a particular proprietary assistive technology.
> That doesn't define "accessible" in my book.

I don't think JFW is alone in this respect, in fact I'm sure it's not.
It's just a simple tree view, you know, like you can get on Explorer, but
which you shouldn't use if you don't have a loppy in the drive when you
scroll past it.  But I'd be surprised if there are screen readers for
Windows out theer that can't access it.

> Could you post an example of its output on this list that's
> readable? Or is that a hack? If it's a hack, then it's not
> accessible from that measure as well.

Hmmm, I will try, but I don't think I'd be able to do it, because I can't
easily copy stuff from it to the clip board I don't think.  Unless, of
course, someone knows how to edit a screen dump in Windows.  I'm sorry,
though, I do disagree with you about the accessibility of this, if, as I
suspect, all screen readers can access it, and no, my access to it is not
a hack.  If I'm honest, 	I do sometimes get a bit frustrated with
people who say that so and so is not accessible, when in fact all it may
require is a little patience.  Ok, it's not *totally* accessible, but to
say that things are *totally* inaccessible if you can't access them with
your first attempt is also ludicrous, and I think is perhaps part of the
reason that there is resistance to making some things accessible, the view
exists in some quarters that we expect everything on a plate and are not
willing to expend any effort.  This is, of course, not true and such an
attitude is no excuse, but imho, there it is.

Cheers.

-- 
Toby Fisher	Email: toby at g0ucu.freeserve.co.uk
Tel.: +44(0)1480 417272	Mobile: +44(0)7974 363239
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