[Support] status of our new images and a request (fwd)

Jude DaShiell jdashiel at panix.com
Wed Feb 17 06:51:27 EST 2016 


-- 


---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2016 01:49:28
From: kendell clark via Support <support at sonargnulinux.com>
Reply-To: kendell clark <coffeekingms at gmail.com>
To: Christopher Chaltain <chaltain at gmail.com>,
     "support at sonargnulinux.com" <support at sonargnulinux.com>
Subject: Re: [Support] status of our new images and a request

hi
Do you have some kind of way to get speakup playing nice with pulse audio? I've 
tried this several times, and the only way I can get this working reliably is 
to either start espeakup *after* the desktop is loaded, rather than on boot, or 
by configuring pulse audio to use dsync in alsa, disabling a lot of it's 
advanced functionality in the process. Leaving both configured as they are out 
of the box results in no sound from speakup getting through once you're logged 
in. This is why I say that it doesn't work on modern distros unless you know 
what you're doing. I'm trying to get this working for new users who won't know 
and most likely wouldn't care if I bothered to explain, which I find myself 
less and less inclined to do as time goes by. Having said all that, I'd be glad 
to make this work reliably if there's some sort of configuration I can perform 
that would allow speakup to work, while also allowing pulse audio to work like 
it's intended. One other issue I've noticed is that while pulse audio can rout 
most audio over to new devices or back and forth between sound devices with no 
problems, speakup doesn't allow this and only works on whatever sound device it 
did when started. I think this might be either because it's using alsa, 
unlikely, or that it's running as root, and so pulse audio can't mess with it.

Thanks
Kendell clark


Christopher Chaltain via Support wrote:
> I'm confused. I'm running a modern distro with PulseAudio, and I use SpeakUp 
> all of the time. Therefore, I'm not sure what you mean when you say SpeakUp 
> doesn't work with modern distros using PulseAudio.
> 
> On 16/02/16 17:19, kendell clark via Support wrote:
>> hi
>> This is what I think as well. There needs a lot, and I do mean a lot, of
>> work done before I'd consider speakup a good quality console screen
>> reader. Right now it works, providing you're not using a modern linux
>> distro with pulse audio running, like most do now, espeakup which is not
>> under active development anymore because the developer who started it is
>> deceased. Someone else needs to pick it up again but everyone I talk to,
>> the few I can get to talk to me use that damn ibmtts with ttsynth and
>> don't care about it. I'm not skilled enough or I'd take it on but I have
>> enough to do fixing words in espeak. Speakup isn't in the mainline
>> kernel tree because it apparently, I can't say one way or the other
>> because I don't know, does some tricks to talk to hardware synths that
>> the kernel people don't like, like talking to the hardware in raw data
>> streams instead of using APIs. I think the problem there is that these
>> synths are not made anymore and when they were all the "official"
>> support was for windows and the companies wouldn't give them details so
>> they had to basically hack support.
>> Thanks
>> Kendell clark
>> 
>> 
>> benjamin moser via Support wrote:
>>> Hi
>>> 
>>> who is there to bug about espeakup? is that still under development?
>>> When I look at speakup on the web, it looks like nothing is being done
>>> anymore (possibly because they think nothing else needs to be done.)
>>> 
>>> On 2/14/2016 5:55 PM, kendell clark via Support wrote:
>>>> hi
>>>> We've been wanting to make one for a while. We keep running into
>>>> either 1, issues with speakup when pulse audio is running, been
>>>> present for years and no one will own up to it or 2, brltty, which can
>>>> work as a console screen reader. Right now it doesn't support the
>>>> espeak fork, called espeak-ng, which sonar has switched to using. It's
>>>> rather embarrassing, and my own personal opinion is that all the blind
>>>> users who care about command line access, storm comes to mind, should
>>>> band together and bug the shit out of the speakup people until they
>>>> fix their bug. It's actually a combination of speakup, and the fact
>>>> that speakup runs in the kernel, which means it runs as root, which
>>>> means it's not subject to user permissions. Why that means it doesn't
>>>> produce sound I'm not sure, but it doesn't. If pulse audio isn't
>>>> running this just works, but otherwise ... shrug.
>>>> Thanks
>>>> Kendell clark
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Simon Eigeldinger via Support wrote:
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> 
>>>>> ah sorry forgot about the command line users.
>>>>> maybe interesting when there will be maybe some console based sonar
>>>>> isos.
>>>>> 
>>>>> greetings,
>>>>> simon
>>>>> 
>>>>> Am 14.02.2016 um 17:40 schrieb Jude DaShiell:
>>>>>> youtube-viewer I use on talkingarch and would install and use that if
>>>>>> accessible in graphical environment if accessible.  When I want to
>>>>>> search for channels in youtube-viewer I know how to do that.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Sun, 14 Feb 2016, Simon Eigeldinger via Support wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Date: Sun, 14 Feb 2016 05:23:12
>>>>>>> From: Simon Eigeldinger via Support <support at sonargnulinux.com>
>>>>>>> Reply-To: Simon Eigeldinger <simon.eigeldinger at vol.at>
>>>>>>> To: support at sonargnulinux.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Support] status of our new images and a request
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Here's my take at the package liss:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> packages-desktop:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> maybe getting ried of:
>>>>>>> elinks: Is someone using that? seems not to work on my system.
>>>>>>> youtube-viewer: never used it used firefox.
>>>>>>> rythmbox: replacing it with audacious? gtk ipod tool is installed as
>>>>>>> well. no good solution?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Maybe packages to be added:
>>>>>>> veracrypt from aur: disk and container encryption tool. pretty
>>>>>>> accessible.
>>>>>>> audacious: maybe better than rythmbox
>>>>>>> corebird: twitter client. pretty accessible.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> packages-gnome: no ideas what to remove or add.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> packages-mate: no ideas what to remove or add.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> greetings,
>>>>>>> simon
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Am 14.02.2016 um 02:58 schrieb kendell clark via Support:
>>>>>>>> hi
>>>>>>>> Here goes. Packages-desktop, which is common packages that both
>>>>>>>> gnome
>>>>>>>> and mate use, is pasted hear.
>>>>>>>> http://paste.pound-python.org/show/4Ykrak83Bhg4BjZF2EmH/.
>>>>>>>> Packages-gnome
>>>>>>>> can be seen hear.
>>>>>>>> http://paste.pound-python.org/show/o03gJEMO8B4IyN81dOcw/.
>>>>>>>> Packages-mate
>>>>>>>> can be seen hear,
>>>>>>>> http://paste.pound-python.org/show/RDbaW2X3Legc3zLOt63Y/.
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> Kendell clark
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Hadi via Support wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Kendell, Is it possible that you pastebin the mentioned files so we
>>>>>>>>> could take a look at it? There are some great pastebin sites like
>>>>>>>>> slexy.org.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 2/13/2016 2:56 PM, kendell clark via Support wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> hi all
>>>>>>>>>> Well, it's been long enough. I've been working with phil and
>>>>>>>>>> teo to
>>>>>>>>>> improve the accessibility of calamares, but it's just not there
>>>>>>>>>> yet
>>>>>>>>>> so I'm going to release new gnome and mate images with our old
>>>>>>>>>> installer, thus, instead. I've waited more than long enough and
>>>>>>>>>> I'll
>>>>>>>>>> write back in as soon as the 32 bit and 64 bit images are
>>>>>>>>>> uploaded.
>>>>>>>>>> Before I upload the images though, I want to do some serious
>>>>>>>>>> cleanup
>>>>>>>>>> on our software selection. I've tried installing just about every
>>>>>>>>>> piece of software under the sun that a blind person might possibly
>>>>>>>>>> want on the live image, mainly to show a newcomer exactly what
>>>>>>>>>> linux
>>>>>>>>>> can do. But I think it's more than past time to thin the
>>>>>>>>>> selection,
>>>>>>>>>> at least on the live images, considerably. Would all of you who
>>>>>>>>>> can,
>>>>>>>>>> clone our software repository and look at the Packages-Desktop
>>>>>>>>>> file,
>>>>>>>>>> as well as the main packages-gnome and packages-mate files and
>>>>>>>>>> tell
>>>>>>>>>> me what software can be cut? The image sizes are getting out of
>>>>>>>>>> control, they've just surpassed the 2.0 gb mark, and I'd like to
>>>>>>>>>> trim
>>>>>>>>>> that down. To get our git repository, open a terminal and issue
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> following commands. Git clone
>>>>>>>>>> https://github.com/manjaro/manjaro-tools-iso-profiles.git. Wait
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> it to clone, it shouldn't take too long, then change into the
>>>>>>>>>> folder,
>>>>>>>>>> then into the sonar folder. The packages-desktop file is shared
>>>>>>>>>> between the gnome and mate profiles, so it's in the shared folder.
>>>>>>>>>> The others are in the gnome and mate folders, respectively. Again,
>>>>>>>>>> I'll write back in when the images are uploaded but I'll wait on
>>>>>>>>>> community feedback so I know what to remove, and once I have that,
>>>>>>>>>> I'll then build the images and upload them to sourceforge. I'm
>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>> sorry for the long delay, but I was trying to get calamares into a
>>>>>>>>>> usable state, but it's just not there yet. Thank you all of you
>>>>>>>>>> who
>>>>>>>>>> have been patient and waiting for new images, it's definitely
>>>>>>>>>> been a
>>>>>>>>>> little more trouble than last time, that's for sure, grins.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>> Kendell clark
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Support mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Support at sonargnulinux.com
>>>>>>>>>> http://sonargnulinux.com/mailman/listinfo/support_sonargnulinux.com 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Support mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Support at sonargnulinux.com
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>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Support mailing list
>>>>>>>> Support at sonargnulinux.com
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>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>> 
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>> 
>> 
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>


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